Club Tryouts--Unethical?

More
10 years 8 months ago #28697 by VBCoach
Replied by VBCoach on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
Responsible;

Please notify the following members of the WEVA Board of Directors of the incident;

Commissioner - John W. Hughes, Sr. (H) 585-259-6557 wevajohn@rochester.rr.com
President - Rocco Lucci, Jr. (H) 716-807-0858 roccolucci@gmail.com
Vice President - Fred Chase (C) 585-313-3039
(H) 585-671-2113 fchase@rochester.rr.com
Junior Coordinator - Cindy D’Errico (H) 585-548-2598 dderric1@rochester.rr.com

Please include the director of the club that this coach represents.

Thank you

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28698 by volleyrock
Replied by volleyrock on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by VBall6</i>

VB101 there were 2 teams that qualified for Open from Rochester. Those teams each had 2 girls from Buffalo on them. Those teams also qualified when there was 1 National Championship. Today there is a diluted National picture since the JDVA came on the scene. Nationals no longer include some of the best clubs from around the country as they participate in the JDVA.
I also believe that those girls developed because of their club coaching and their exposure to the level of play outside the region, they were recognized by D1 programs by participating at a high level on the National stage.



<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

vball6: Not sure what other Rochester team your talking about, but the 2006 FX 18's team that played Open in Atlanta had 4 Buffalo kids on it, not 2. That's half the starting line-up and first front row sub in. Those kids had been trained from all over and were a true all-star team at that point. Geez, you better make Open with that.

The comment about USA Nationals is moot since 1. Weva's top performing teams of the past few years compete against, and often beat, many of the best teams of JVA and USAV. Doesn't matter that they run across them in different tourneys. 2. Just as significant is the fact that nationally, junior vball has become MUCH more competitive in the past 5 years. Regions of the country that were nothing but "developing areas" now boast at least 1-2 nationally competitive clubs across the age groups, making USAV just as competitive as it was then. Georgia, Florida, Carolina, Arizona, Kansas, Oregon, Oklahoma, among others ALL have top clubs that now compete with the traditional big boys (girls) from Texas, Cali, Illinois, Ohio, and Kentucky. In 2005-06, that was not really the case. Some of those regions/clubs were just emerging.

We do need to produce MANY more top players so that all our top teams & players are consistently pushed every weekend and every practice by having other top players (and teams) breathing down their necks.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28699 by VBall6
Replied by VBall6 on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
VolleyRock, I stand corrected on the number of girls from Buffalo on the Atlanta team I was thinking of the following years team that qualified in Minneapolis. I still believe the level of the USAV qualifiers has been watered down. I agree that it is still very important to go outside your region to play top teams but when you go to Nationals at USAV and take out clubs like, Sports Performance, Munciana, Synergy, Nebraska Jr's, Front Range.... you do lose something

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28700 by volleyrock
Replied by volleyrock on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
Ok. Vball6: The only club you mention that does not participate in USAV Qualifiers is SPVB. All the others have been regulars at Qualifiers since the split. The only team at the Northern Lights Qualifier (the one you speak of where FX qualified) that is now with JVA is Milwaukee Sting. The rest have continued to compete in Qualifiers since. And, again, there are SO many clubs from formerly vball-dead regions who now make qualifiers even more competitive than they were. At Chicago last year, a team from Oregon played SPVB 18-1's to a dead heat in the finals of SPVB's own tourney. Oregon vb was nonexistent just 3-4 years ago.

VB101 is absolutely right about the need to develop many, many more high quality players who can compete against each other at every practice and at every tourney, not just the ones they travel 100's of miles to. He's also dead-on about top players (past & present) being on coaches' radar way before junior and senior year. That was true with many of those kids you are alluding to and certainly true with our kids today. The calls, visits to the training facility, and emails are coming to us about 15 & 16 year olds. However, top kids do need to train and compete with other top players to continue to develop, just as a hitter needs an advanced setter to help her to continue to grow.

To the manipulation of kids topic, all you have to do to stop or charge a club with unethical harrassment of players is 1. Simply tell them to contact your present or past year's club coach or director with their inquiries from now on. Give them the numbers. 2. Document and file any texts, emails, phone calls, or personal conversations. We have hard copies of texts and emails from a club harrassing kids even after they committed to another club or who they had no prior relationship with and who did not contact them first--both strikes against present "Spirit of Weva" rules. Our kids just report the contacts to us and we document them.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28701 by volleyrock
Replied by volleyrock on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
Oh--and my apologies. There were two teams from RA that qualified Open.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28702 by Kingofthehill
Replied by Kingofthehill on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
Each year when we converse with out of area recruits- texas kids, california kids, etc - I'm always interested to hear their reaction when I tell them that club has already started tryouts here. They all begin in December there- with tryouts etc.

That fact doesn't make it right or wrong, just an interesting juxtaposition.

(How'd I do with that word, vb101?)

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28703 by raider1
Replied by raider1 on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Kingofthehill</i>

Each year when we converse with out of area recruits- texas kids, california kids, etc - I'm always interested to hear their reaction when I tell them that club has already started tryouts here. They all begin in December there- with tryouts etc.

That fact doesn't make it right or wrong, just an interesting juxtaposition.

(How'd I do with that word, vb101?)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Not sure about California, but most Texas clubs I know run tryouts about two weeks after Nationals are over (in July)--For years each Texas club would bump its tryouts two weeks before the others to beat them to the best kids. Result? Tryouts are about as early as they can be without occurring BEFORE the previous season is over.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28705 by chanthavisouk
Replied by chanthavisouk on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
In Ohio, I think the rule is no tryouts until after HS States and no more than 3 kids from a school on a team, unless your'e a senior in HS, I don't think it comes from the OVR, but from OHSAA.
I believe California the SCVA sets dates for official offers and commitments in SoCal. http://scvavolleyball.org/girls_tryouts.htm
In NoCal the NCVA does the same: http://www.ncva.com/Object.aspx?ID=563
I'm not sure if the CA State HS Association(s) sets any mandates.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28707 by Kingofthehill
Replied by Kingofthehill on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by chanthavisouk</i>

In Ohio, I think the rule is no tryouts until after HS States and no more than 3 kids from a school on a team, unless your'e a senior in HS, I don't think it comes from the OVR, but from OHSAA.
I believe California the SCVA sets dates for official offers and commitments in SoCal. http://scvavolleyball.org/girls_tryouts.htm
In NoCal the NCVA does the same: http://www.ncva.com/Object.aspx?ID=563
I'm not sure if the CA State HS Association(s) sets any mandates.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Yup-

Right from the socal site:
Please note, the SCVA highly recommends and encourages all junior players to wait until their high school season is over prior to trying out for the club season. Along with the list of first tryout dates.

Again, I make no claim as to what is right and wrong. Teams/clubs want good players, because people are competitive by nature and realize there are two ways to have a good team- coach players to be better and get good players to be on your team. Competitive coaches attempt do both.

Ethics depends on perspective and outlook- are you searching for what is right/wrong based on rules/laws/policies? Are you searching for what makes the most good for the most people? Are you searching for people that make decisions solely based on what they think is right, and are willing to accept responsibility for their actions. Those factors essentially determine the ethical value of the situation.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28708 by vb101
Replied by vb101 on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
Yep, Texas has tryouts in the summer for clubs. In Ohio, there have been some groans recently about a club having tryouts during the summer, too. Got away with it up to now, because the club is claiming to be an "AAU team," that doesn't intend to be USA. But people are crying foul, because there may be another tryout after high school season, where those same kids could be on a USA team, too.

This recruiting babel is everywhere; I don't know if I can claim to be lucky to have seen it in Texas and SoCal or not, because it wasn't pleasant to be a part of and I wish I hadn't.

If I grant that Rochester has had two open teams (with significant Buffalo help) reach the Nationals, still how have the girls done? I have first hand knowledge that a 14 under girls team took a 20th at Nationals, pre the open/national/american split. But no knowledge of anything significant. Or even a buzz that college coaches should hit the hotbed of Rochester, NY. Rochester, MN, though, I've heard that. Even the Atlanta squad (probably the most reknowned) didn't bring the coaches flocking to WNY.

More work has to be done. More time has to be spent. Braggadocio (like that word king?) needs to be curtailed and development should be the byword, not being the best recruiter. Create a plethora of talented players and well maybe our Rochester girls will get the same respect that the boys do.

The dissolution of USA volleyball/JVA/AAU situation is unfortunate, but attend either championship and the quality of play is pretty strong at both venues among the higher echelon. Perhaps not at the other levels, not as much depth, but interestingly I think that the split has led to an opportunity for other programs to rise and develop the confidence to become great. Would still like to see them reunite, though. Now instead of SPRi winning 12 medals at Nationals, others rise, not necessarily a bad thing.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 8 months ago #28709 by Kingofthehill
Replied by Kingofthehill on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
I actually have to look that one up- but I can use context clues to make an educated guess.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
10 years 7 months ago #28962 by OP
Replied by OP on topic Club Tryouts--Unethical?
It's all un ethical. OR its just the natural evolution of things. i don't like it as much as you. But this is what it is now

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Time to create page: 0.164 seconds